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Fake Dell E6420 9 cell battery problem that looks Original  

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torture
(@torture)
Estimable Member
Posted by: @tiit26

picture

1623311117-20210610_103955.jpg

The PCB is genuine DELL and the chip also, but the battery has been recelled. I can clearly see signs of soldering and flux on the cell connection poins on the PCB. These points are also originally covered with the same yellow varnish that you see on other areas. The cells look like genuine Samsung maybe refurbished, not sure.

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Posted : 10/06/2021 2:16 pm
Nicusor
(@azzido)
Member Admin
Posted by: @tiit26

picture

1623311079-20210610_103934.jpg

These cells do not look as new. They seem to be used.

I would say the seller refurbished the batteries using Dell original PCBs. It makes sense, there are tons of faulty Dell batteries and it is not bad to repair them. But in your case it seems that repairing was not done 100% correctly. Have you reported these findings to the seller ?

NLBA Laptop Battery Analyzer with Chip Reset & Repair Option

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Posted : 10/06/2021 3:45 pm
batFix
(@batfix)
Estimable Member

@torture

I wouldn't be so exited.

Different batches of cells could bring bad surprises, regardless of its impedance and voltages match..

I can tell that from my current personal experience  with Dell batteries - syncing voltages a few times, but getting different discharge slope 🙁

Lets Make NLBA Great ! Together.

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Posted : 10/06/2021 5:44 pm
batFix
(@batfix)
Estimable Member

@tiit26.

small tip - You will have better and half size snapshot, if you'' press ALT+PrtScrn, it will take only current window, not whole desktop.

Lets Make NLBA Great ! Together.

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Posted : 10/06/2021 5:49 pm
torture
(@torture)
Estimable Member

@batfix

Your comments are absolutely useless and do not help in analyzing or solving anything. I understand that you are desperately seeking for attention but this is not the right place. People come here to learn or share experience, which you have none. I'm kindly asking you one more time please stop with the spam.

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Posted : 10/06/2021 6:10 pm
tiit26
(@tiit26)
Eminent Member
Posted by: @azzido
Posted by: @tiit26

picture

1623311079-20210610_103934.jpg

These cells do not look as new. They seem to be used.

I would say the seller refurbished the batteries using Dell original PCBs. It makes sense, there are tons of faulty Dell batteries and it is not bad to repair them. But in your case it seems that repairing was not done 100% correctly. Have you reported these findings to the seller ?

yes ,i reporting, i give this thread link 😊 

and no quaranty problem, if something not normal, it send me new one.

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Posted : 10/06/2021 9:55 pm
DjiBattWorkshop
(@djibattworkshop)
Reputable Member
Posted by: @torture

These points are also originally covered with the same yellow varnish that you see on other areas.

Yes, correct, this is how connection points look like on intact genuine pcb.

 

1623420668-IMG_20210611_170617.jpg
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Posted : 11/06/2021 3:11 pm
DjiBattWorkshop
(@djibattworkshop)
Reputable Member
Posted by: @tiit26

But unforunately both eeprom, 8740mah and 9000mah did not fix. I try 2-3 battery both eeprom, i try change charger, nothing change

try one more dump, it has Charging Current settings 6300mAh, same like genuine 9-cell Dell battery designed for Express Charge (TM).

Use adequate charger for 97Wh battery in this test.

 

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Posted : 11/06/2021 3:19 pm
batFix
(@batfix)
Estimable Member

Here is follow up on the point of not equal cells from different batches:

- I posted last month pictures of two bad Dell batteries; later I began combine still working pairs of those two into one working.

The result is not that great, it's illustrating my point - different batch of cell have different slopes and regardless my many attempts to balance voltages, the discharge curves are different. What do triggering shut off early eg provide less energy than all cell could.

Snapshots would tell you the story.

1623435476-dell_bat1.jpg
1623435499-dell_bat2.jpg
1623435517-dell_bat3.jpg
1623435540-dell_bat4.jpg

Lets Make NLBA Great ! Together.

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Posted : 11/06/2021 7:17 pm
DjiBattWorkshop
(@djibattworkshop)
Reputable Member
Posted by: @batfix

later I began combine still working pairs of those two into one working

So you have mixed the cells with different manufacture date, different cycles count served, different chemistry and ... probably even different design capacity. And what you would be expecting of this "repair"?

It's just a wasting of time. Buy new cells and be happy!

 

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Posted : 11/06/2021 7:57 pm
torture liked
batFix
(@batfix)
Estimable Member

You are correct about use new cells, perhaps I'll do that when I'll buy welding machine.

This time it was cheapskate attempt 🙂 the cells looks the same...

 

BTW, I did one more cycle and the "fixed" battery drop its capacity to 850 mAh from 1070 🙁

Lets Make NLBA Great ! Together.

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Posted : 11/06/2021 9:28 pm
Nicusor
(@azzido)
Member Admin

@batfix

I hope you didn't mixt the cells inside a parallel-group. It's not recommended. In a parallel-group, the cells should have almost the same internal resistance, same chemistry, etc. Otherwise, according to Kirchoff's law, one will drain a current much higher than the other one, one will heat up higher than the other one, and so on.

As @djibattworkshop mentioned, it is definitely a waste of time. Use the cells in other fields like flashing lights, electronic cigarettes, power banks, etc. but not in laptop batteries that are driven by complex "smart" microcontrollers.

NLBA Laptop Battery Analyzer with Chip Reset & Repair Option

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Posted : 12/06/2021 5:02 pm
batFix
(@batfix)
Estimable Member

Probably, you missed my initial posts with pictures of the two bad Dell batteries... I do keep all the pairs of cells intact, after got rid off 2 bad pairs in each battery.

All my attempts to combine the four pairs didn't make one good enough battery 🙁 regardless how many times I did sync its voltage. Last posted NBLA snapshots clearly show cells could be a same model, have voltage and capacity, made by same mfg but expose different curve of discharging. What lead to early cutoff by the battery's mC, eg much lower capacity,

It was my illustration, a response to some posts where people don't pay attention other factors beside only voltage sync when changing some cells in a battery.

And here is big advantage to have NBLA what will help you in your job,

Lets Make NLBA Great ! Together.

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Posted : 12/06/2021 5:19 pm
Nicusor
(@azzido)
Member Admin

@batfix

One note from my side, maybe it is already clear, a higher Internal Resistance will produce a higher voltage drop (bigger negative slope).

During discharging, the voltage curves of a good battery will almost be overlapped. The delta deviation could be determined from testing different cells with different Internal Resistance. Actually, it is the same concept as the one used to estimate how good cells are. In one of the previous versions, NLBA was able to computed and print the slope, I designed an algorithm to show how good are the cells but in the end, it was quite the same as estimation done using internal resistance since there is a direct relationship between IR and voltage slope.

I have in mind a good feature for the future, to compute the deviation between all voltage curves and to show it (max and min).

If you got these points you can really help the community by creating How-To tutorials like @torture already did. They are the key in analyzing and repairing laptop batteries. NLBA is powerful enough, if people know how to handle it then many things can be done.

This post was modified 2 weeks ago 2 times by Nicusor

NLBA Laptop Battery Analyzer with Chip Reset & Repair Option

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Posted : 12/06/2021 5:27 pm
Tech2009 liked
batFix
(@batfix)
Estimable Member
Posted by: @azzido

I have in mind a good feature for the future, to compute the deviation between all voltage curves and to show it (max and min).

It would be good addition to NBLA SW, it will definitely help to test replacing cells and future functioning a battery in whole,

As to correlation IR and Vdchg slope, I would add to that a chemical variations in electrodes/electrolyte of cells from one batch to other from same mfg. It was buried in my attempt to got USA patent while working for one big company a few years ago.

Lets Make NLBA Great ! Together.

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Posted : 12/06/2021 5:50 pm
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